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  • Originally posted by DudeClassicMan View Post
    The INT's and sacks do back up him being a Hall Of Famer. Find the guys with more sacks or INT's playing as an inside linebacker that got snubbed; or with more All Pro nominations which are given based who was the very best each given season unlike the Pro Bowl popularity contest bullshit.

    Thomas- 20.5 sacks, 17 INT
    Mills- 20.5 sacks, 11 INT
    Lewis- 52.5 sacks, 14 INT
    Norton- 12.5 sacks, 6 INT
    Edwards- 23.5 sacks, 28 INT
    I see your point but look at London Fletcher only 3 pro-bowl nods and not a single all-pro when they have similar total stats or give London a couple more years and will be even closer. If you break down Ray's all-pro years 1999,2000,2001.2003 totally earned!

    2004,2008,2009 definitely not earned in my opinion stat wise.

    I guess the main point I have to make is Ray got where he is from being a loud mouth braggert but yes some of his years were amazing but in a career with that many games injured/time off and with that good of a defense behind him I don't think he deserves to be in the hall but he will be of course.

    Ed Reed
    Terrell Suggs
    Peter Boulware
    Haloti Ngata
    Chris McAlister
    Rod Woodson
    Adalius Thomas
    Sam Adams
    Michael McCrary
    Brendon Ayanbadejo
    Bart Scott
    Bennie Thompson
    Eric Turner

    All ravens on defense that were in at least one pro-bowl when Ray has been on the team.
    <a href=https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CNs0YcCVAAEiEHI.jpg target=_blank>https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CNs0YcCVAAEiEHI.jpg</a>
    R.I.P.

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    • Hell, maybe LT didn't deserve to be in the Hall Of Fame then. I mean the Giants other linebackers were only Hall Of Famer Harry Carson and All-Decade Carlton Banks not to mention Leonard Marshall; All Pro defensive end in '85 and '86 when Taylor had a career-best 20.5 sacks.

      Furthermore, six guys whose careers overlapped LT finished with more career sacks than him. He's only ranked 9th in career sacks now. Can we retroactively take this overrated deviant crackheaded bum out of the Hall Of Fame please?

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      • Originally posted by DudeClassicMan View Post
        Hell, maybe LT didn't deserve to be in the Hall Of Fame then. I mean the Giants other linebackers were only Hall Of Famer Harry Carson and All-Decade Carlton Banks not to mention Leonard Marshall; All Pro defensive end in '85 and '86 when Taylor had a career-best 20.5 sacks.

        Furthermore, six guys whose careers overlapped LT finished with more career sacks than him. He's only ranked 9th in career sacks now. Can we retroactively take this overrated deviant crackheaded bum out of the Hall Of Fame please?
        He is definitely a deviant crackhead but Lawrence came onto the scene like no other OLB did and he really did change the game when it came to getting to the quaterback from the outside.
        <a href=https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CNs0YcCVAAEiEHI.jpg target=_blank>https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CNs0YcCVAAEiEHI.jpg</a>
        R.I.P.

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        • Originally posted by Freddy_Lives View Post
          He is definitely a deviant crackhead but Lawrence came onto the scene like no other OLB did and he really did change the game when it came to getting to the quaterback from the outside.
          That was purely sarcasm on my part. I find it's much more fun when I don't use some cheeky sarcasm font or emoticons to tip anybody off.

          Of course, LT was a Hall Of Famer. My point was how nobody uses that kind of cop-out to try to keep any defender out of the Hall; how good their supporting cast was. It's cut and dry who is an all-time great and who isn't at a position like MLB. Supporting cast shit really only matters if you're talking about QB's.

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          • Originally posted by DudeClassicMan View Post
            That was purely sarcasm on my part. I find it's much more fun when I don't use some cheeky sarcasm font or emoticons to tip anybody off.

            Of course, LT was a Hall Of Famer. My point was how nobody uses that kind of cop-out to try to keep any defender out of the Hall; how good their supporting cast was. It's cut and dry who is an all-time great and who isn't at a position like MLB. Supporting cast shit really only matters if you're talking about QB's.
            I agree it's definitely lengths and bounds bigger when it comes to the QB but I still don't think Ray deserves to be in the hall

            But if anyone thinks he does they as you have clearly made it have a right to say so and make a good case for him.

            Michael Irvin is in the hall which I really don't believe he deserved to be in either.
            <a href=https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CNs0YcCVAAEiEHI.jpg target=_blank>https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CNs0YcCVAAEiEHI.jpg</a>
            R.I.P.

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            • Originally posted by Freddy_Lives View Post
              I agree it's definitely lengths and bounds bigger when it comes to the QB but I still don't think Ray deserves to be in the hall

              But if anyone thinks he does they as you have clearly made it have a right to say so and make a good case for him.

              Michael Irvin is in the hall which I really don't believe he deserved to be in either.
              Everybody thinks Lewis belongs in the Hall. Nobody's making a case for all those other guys that came and went on the Ravens being Hall Of Famers. By the time Rod Woodson was on the Ravens he had already transitioned over to safety.

              Irvin got in by being the 2nd best receiver in the league during his prime playing on the last real dynasty and being a clutch postseason performer during those runs; he's still 2nd in postseason receiving yards to Jerry Rice.
              Last edited by DudeClassicMan; 02-02-2013, 04:20 PM.

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              • Originally posted by DudeClassicMan View Post
                Everybody thinks Lewis belongs in the Hall. Nobody's making a case for all those other guys that came and went on the Ravens being Hall Of Famers. By the time Rod Woodson was on the Ravens he had already transitioned over to safety.

                Irvin got in by being the 2nd best receiver in the league during his prime playing on the last real dynasty and being a clutch postseason performer during those runs; he's still 2nd in postseason receiving yards to Jerry Rice.
                I think MANY people believe he doesn't belong in the hall look at today Michael Strahan didn't get into the hall what does that tell you ?

                Irvin is 21 on the freaking yardage list and 45th in touchdowns THAT is not hall of fame caliber FACT he got in because he was a show-boat plain and simple.
                <a href=https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CNs0YcCVAAEiEHI.jpg target=_blank>https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CNs0YcCVAAEiEHI.jpg</a>
                R.I.P.

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                • Originally posted by Freddy_Lives View Post
                  I think MANY people believe he doesn't belong in the hall look at today Michael Strahan didn't get into the hall what does that tell you ?

                  Irvin is 21 on the freaking yardage list and 45th in touchdowns THAT is not hall of fame caliber FACT he got in because he was a show-boat plain and simple.
                  Cite a few of those MANY besides you; people who are either members themselves or who have a vote.

                  It isn't the fantasy freaking football hall of fame; the game is a lot more than STAAAAAAATS! which is what makes it so great and people with common sense and a working pair of eyeballs can tell who was an all-time great and who wasn't.

                  Irvin played when the league was still a 50/50 run/pass league and defenders (especially defensive backs) weren't neutered yet. As long as you play relatively long enough, the Hall is hardly quantity over quality either. Irvin played in 156 games. Most of those guys ahead of him played in well over 200. How many of those guys that are ahead of Irvin are current players that had the advantage of playing most of their careers in the current souped up neutered defender NFL?

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                  • Originally posted by DudeClassicMan View Post
                    Irvin played when the league was still a 50/50 run/pass league and defenders (especially defensive backs) weren't neutered yet. As long as you play relatively long enough, the Hall is hardly quantity over quality either. Irvin played in 156 games. Most of those guys ahead of him played in well over 200. How many of those guys that are ahead of Irvin are current players that had the advantage of playing most of their careers in the current souped up neutered defender NFL?
                    Then anybody with eyeballs should see that Michael Strahan,Zach Thomas,Tim Brown who played when Michael did and was by far better,Jerome Bettis,Will Shields,Sam Adams,Anenas Williams,Troy Vincent

                    Just Wideouts that played during his time? Tim Brown,Jimmy Smith,Keenan McCardell,Andre Reed,Rod Smith all have more yards some are superbowl winners and aren't 46th in touchdowns either.

                    That's the short list of eligible players that belong in the hall way before Michael Irvin.
                    <a href=https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CNs0YcCVAAEiEHI.jpg target=_blank>https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CNs0YcCVAAEiEHI.jpg</a>
                    R.I.P.

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                    • Originally posted by Freddy_Lives View Post
                      Then anybody with eyeballs should see that Michael Strahan,Zach Thomas,Tim Brown who played when Michael did and was by far better,Jerome Bettis,Will Shields,Sam Adams,Anenas Williams,Troy Vincent

                      Just Wideouts that played during his time? Tim Brown,Jimmy Smith,Keenan McCardell,Andre Reed,Rod Smith all have more yards some are superbowl winners and aren't 46th in touchdowns either.

                      That's the short list of eligible players that belong in the hall way before Michael Irvin.
                      Keenan McCardell & Troy Vincent belong in the hall over Irvin? And way before no less? You're out of your mind. Keenan McCardell in particular is your prototypical stat compiler. And this is coming from a Steelers fan who by nature can't stand the Cowboys.

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                      • Originally posted by Sea Hag View Post
                        Keenan McCardell & Troy Vincent belong in the hall over Irvin? And way before no less? You're out of your mind. Keenan McCardell in particular is your prototypical stat compiler. And this is coming from a Steelers fan who by nature can't stand the Cowboys.
                        Almost identical stats and he never had a great QB granted Mark who happens to be my favorite QB had some good years he mirrored Michaels stats and Mike had a Hall of fame QB throwing to him?

                        What makes Michael Irvin so special? It's totally 100% opinion mind you Keenan was a 12th round draft pick WHO EARNED his starting job.

                        If none of you can actually admit being a loud mouth braggert helps your case then you really don't understand the politics of the NFL.

                        Humble players get the screw job.
                        <a href=https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CNs0YcCVAAEiEHI.jpg target=_blank>https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CNs0YcCVAAEiEHI.jpg</a>
                        R.I.P.

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                        • BTW I don't think Keenan belongs in the Hall i'm just saying he is a 2 time superbowl champion over 600 yards in the postseason with 6 touchdowns michael only had 8 in the postseason.

                          But how did Michael get into the hall? By being a loud mouth coke head.
                          <a href=https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CNs0YcCVAAEiEHI.jpg target=_blank>https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CNs0YcCVAAEiEHI.jpg</a>
                          R.I.P.

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                          • Originally posted by Freddy_Lives View Post
                            Almost identical stats and he never had a great QB granted Mark who happens to be my favorite QB had some good years he mirrored Michaels stats and Mike had a Hall of fame QB throwing to him?
                            Uh, you miss the part where I pointed out that McCardell is a protypical stat compiler? He played 4 more seasons than Irvin did.

                            What makes Michael Irvin so special?
                            Stats & most importantly postseason performance. He also helped define his position in his era. And during his peak years he was better than all those receivers you listed with the exception of maybe Tim Brown

                            It's totally 100% opinion mind you Keenan was a 12th round draft pick WHO EARNED his starting job.
                            So Irvin didn't deserve to be drafted high and get playing time in his first year in the league? Where McCardell or Irvin were drafted is neither here nor there. To think it somehow helps your warped view is misguided to say the least.

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                            Recent Flicks
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                            • michael irvin was the motherfucking heartbeat of the dallas cowboys. his stats were fine, but his contributions went beyond stats (and his career was cut short, and his first three seasons were shortened by injury, and the all-time leading runner in nfl history was accounting for most of the yards and touchdowns). nobody practiced harder, no one worked harder, no one wanted it more than michael. he absolutely belongs in the hall-of-fame, and he played big always. you ever see michael irivn drop a pass or shy away from a block or give up on a route or fail to hustle down the field whether he was involved in the play or not? michael irvin was a great player and personally, i miss him desperately. he's right where he blongs.

                              now, if only my man coulda kept his nose outta the powder. i promise you, we would have won in 96, too...


                              Wes Craven, RIP
                              1939-2015


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                              • Originally posted by Freddy_Lives View Post
                                But how did Michael get into the hall? By being a loud mouth coke head.
                                you're a loud mouth coke head

                                but seriously, he got in cus he was the heart and soul of one of history's greatest teams, and he produced always.


                                Wes Craven, RIP
                                1939-2015


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