Interviews
‘Cobweb’ – Director Samuel Bodin and Star Woody Norman Take You Inside Their Horror Fairy Tale [Interview]
Note: This Cobweb interview was conducted prior to the current SAG-AFTRA strike.
Samuel Bodin, the creator of Netflix horror series “Marianne,” returns to the genre with Lionsgate’s horror movie Cobweb, releasing in theaters on July 21.
Cobweb, written by Chris Thomas Devlin, follows eight-year-old Peter (Woody Norman, The Last Voyage of the Demeter) as mysterious tappings from within his bedroom walls lead him to suspect his parents (Lizzy Caplan and Antony Starr) are hiding a terrible secret.
Ahead of the film’s release, Bloody Disgusting spoke with both Samuel Bodin and Woody Norman about their gateway horror fairy tale and the scares you’ll find nestled within.
Much like “Marianne,” Bodin injects Cobweb with a fairy tale quality, well-suited for the scary bedtime story-like nightmares its young protagonist endures. While the similarities end there between “Marianne” and Cobweb, it does highlight Bodin’s affinity for building backstories.
The filmmaker explains his approach, “I always try to attack a story as the story demands. But to be honest, I love to build a little universe, so it’s my way to do it. I take the story, and I say, ‘Okay. It’s not grounded in reality; it’s in that little universe. It’s that little house, that little town for Marianne.’ So, to be honest, it’s the same way. How I can create my little Cobweb universe and tell the story inside that, and for ‘Marianne,’ I did the same. Where is that witch? It’s that town, with that all. So, I built the universe around it, but it’s like Springfield for the Simpsons. It’s our place with our story, and I love that feeling, especially for a scary story. It’s my way to open the door. To jump in the story in a way.”

In other words, Bodin found a vastly different type of horror in Cobweb, despite the fairy tale leanings. The filmmaker worked closely with screenwriter Devlin on Cobweb‘s particular style of scares. Bodin explains, “It was different because for ‘Marianne’ and my other projects, usually, I am the writer or the co-writer of it. It was the first time I dove into the script of someone else. You have your overall feeling on how you want to bring people with you and scare people. But here, there was a journey more psychological. So, I really followed Chris [Thomas Devlin]. We were, both of us, swimming in that story. So, it was step-by-step, sequence by sequence, and we know where we want it to be.
“We didn’t want to have a lot of blood in it. We wanted to be only in a fairytale way, like a bad or a weird Halloween joke. So, we don’t need so much blood; it’s more colorful and weird than bloody. It was an experience with the producers, Chris and me. Because ‘Marianne’ is a little bit more bloody and weird. I love the fact that we can say, during the shoot, that it’s a horror movie for kids. I love that contradiction.”
As for Woody Norman, Cobweb marks the actor’s first-ever role in horror, though you can expect to see him again later this summer in The Last Voyage of the Demeter. It’s a hell of an introduction to the genre; Norman leads the film as a tender-hearted boy constantly torn between whether his parents love him or whether they mean him harm.
The young actor explains how he handled the balancing act: “I think the way I did it was I let myself almost find out as Peter was finding out, by stopping myself from thinking about it. So, in the beginning, I made sure I only thought about the parent characters as parent characters. But when I was doing maybe a scene of complete distrust, I wouldn’t think of the parent characters as parents. I’d think of them as villains, just to stop myself from humanizing them in a way and make me more scared of them as well.”
Cobweb isn’t just a gateway horror film for audiences, but its star too. Norman shares how his experience made him more comfortable in horror.
“There’s a bit where I had to get a harness and get thrown across a hallway. That was really fun,” Norman recalls. “I think my main takeaway is that Cobweb was the job that got me okay with screaming on set. Because before, I was really nervous about it. Sam will remember it took a few takes for me to get comfortable doing it. But now, I’m cool with it. I was having a good time with it. Because filming, for me, is what I love doing most. Making people scared is pretty fun as well. So, putting them two together really makes it a good time.”

While Bodin referred to Cobweb as a horror movie for kids, he injects notable references for the horror kid at heart. One horror master, in particular, significantly influenced Bodin for his Halloween-set feature. “John Carpenter, obviously,” he explains. “I am French, so I don’t have the same relationship with Halloween as the US. It was always a dream or a fantasy in my head, ‘Oh, one day maybe I will do a Halloween story,’ and suddenly Cobweb is here. I connect with and reference a lot of John Carpenter’s Halloween. For me, it’s one of the greatest movies of all time. Each time I see a pumpkin, I think about Haddonfield, or that house, and that pumpkin in the opening credits.
“So, Halloween is totally in reference here. I know that Tim Burton was a reference, too, because he helped us in a way to not be in reality. So, Easter eggs, there are a lot of them. You try not to do it because if you listen to yourself, you put only references everywhere. But definitely, if there is only one, it’s Halloween from John Carpenter; it’s obvious, but it’s here.”
Cobweb releases only in theaters on July 21, 2023.
Interviews
Paul Tremblay on Fighting AI with Horror in New Novel ‘Dead But Dreaming of Electric Sheep’
Paul Tremblay didn’t start his writing career believing he’d be battling machines over the sanctity of his job, but like so many writers of his generation, the battle found him. In the years since Large Language Models (LLMs) and neural networks started gaining traction as an advertised shortcut to creativity, Tremblay has been active in lawsuits to prevent the use of his works in training AI models, and he’s found that, with each new project, he has to consider the possibility that some LLM, somewhere, is going to latch on to what he’s creating.
“Now I feel like I’m thinking about, ‘Man, how am I going to write things that would be really hard or impossible for an AI to replicate?’,” Tremblay told me, speaking by Zoom from his home in Massachusetts. “Maybe some of that is ego. I’m sure every writer thinks, ‘Oh, an AI could never write what I write.’ Yes, I’d be lying if I said that wasn’t part of the thought process.”
While that’s something Tremblay might consider with any new work at this point in his career, the Bram Stoker Award-winning author of A Head Full of Ghosts, The Cabin at the End of the World, and many other novels and short stories tackled it in a more direct way with his latest book. Inspired by Philip K. Dick, Harlan Ellison, and the quirky humor of the Coen Brothers, Dead But Dreaming of Electric Sheep is Tremblay’s attempt at a sci-fi-horror mash-up that’s both darkly funny and existentially nightmarish. It’s also, in his own words, a screed against the movement by AI companies to supplant human artists.
“I didn’t want to make it too didactic, but no, I playfully described this book as an anti-AI screed,” he said. “This book, in particular, was driven by anger and frustration, for sure. Not every book is going to be driven that way.“
Despite the emotions that fueled it, Dead But Dreaming of Electric Sheep does not read like a screed. Instead, wielding offbeat humor and tech concepts that feel both lived-in and frighteningly tactile, the book lays out tandem narratives all building to the same conclusion, each of them exploring our relationship to machine learning in a different way. One of these narratives belongs to Julia, a former gaming streamer looking for a new challenge in life, who gets a call from a California tech company with an interesting offer.

Paul Tremblay in documentary series “First Word on Horror”
The company has, it seems, implanted some new technology in a brain-dead middle-aged man which will, in theory, allow them to pilot the man’s body through a rudimentary, still-developing system of controls. Julia, with her gaming background, would be the pilot, in her own way just as much a test subject as the human vegetable she’s controlling.
Julia is a Gen Z streamer with an omnivorous pop culture appetite, inspired by Tremblay’s own adult children, who riffs on The Big Lebowski constantly and calls her strange new meat puppet “Bernie” in reference to Weekend at Bernie’s. Her wide frame of reference, and her interest in art and stories far beyond video games, is in part informed by Tremblay’s own experiences with Gen Z, and in part a response to AI companies who scrape art and culture as a means of consuming it for reference without really experiencing a story.
“I know that one of the arguments that OpenAI and other tech companies are trying to make is like, ‘Hey, you writers, you artists, you take pop culture, you take your influences, and you create something. That’s just the same thing that the bots are doing.’ And it’s just not,” Tremblay said. “I wanted to have Julia have her outlook informed by all this pop culture, and I wanted to make that feel really human as a way to show how inhuman the AI is.”
The other side of the story belongs to “Bernie,” who’s addressed in his point-of-view chapters as “You.” In these chapters, the technology in Bernie’s body starts to flicker images through his seemingly dead brain, delivering half-remembered imagery and perspective in a nod to the “hallucinations” of an AI model groping for understanding it can never reach. These chapters in particular show off Tremblay’s flair for formalist shake-ups, and echo the kind of hyperstimulated writing that Dick and Ellison made so influential.
“I think it was more just the general Philip K. Dick feeling of ‘The world is so strange,'” Tremblay said. “He’s a lot funnier, I think, than maybe a lot of people credit him. That’s definitely what I was thinking of when writing the book.“
Bernie’s chapters embody the strangeness of Dead But Dreaming of Electric Sheep, presenting imagery that’s at times puzzling, at times eerily filmic, and always unnerving. They also mirror Julia’s own journey in fascinating ways as the odd couple – the Gen Z gamer and the middle-aged vegetable – traverse the United States, and the tech in Bernie’s body wakes up to the possibilities of using his flesh for its own purposes. It’s a compelling narrative technique, but it presented some new writing challenges for Tremblay.
“I quickly realized I couldn’t write this book the same way I have in the past,” he said. “By that, I mean all my other novels I had written in the order in which it was presented, even things that are nonlinear, which is most of them. I knew I couldn’t do that in this book. It’s not a spoiler, but hopefully the readers figure out pretty early that the Bernie chapters are a little bit of a preview of the next chapter from Julia, what’s actually happening with Julia. It’s all refracted from him.”

Mary Roach’s Stiff
Dead But Dreaming of Electric Sheep began with a simple image, inspired by Tremblay’s reading of Mary Roach‘s book chronicling the history of our treatment of corpses, Stiff. As he read, Tremblay imagined a body sitting on an airplane, remote-controlled by someone else. At the time, it was a “silly what-if” concept, filed away in his head. Years later, when he became an author suing a tech company to keep AI from scraping his work for ideas, it started to feel frighteningly plausible, taking the “silly what-if” into the territory of a high-concept horror show about what happens when we try to exploit and commodify uniquely human aspects of consciousness.
“It stuck with me,” Tremblay said of that what-if imagery. “And then a few years later, when I was a part of the case suing OpenAI on behalf of writers, that what-if suddenly didn’t seem as silly. The more I learned about how that corporation operates and without really any sort of ethical thought to anything, I was like, ‘Oh, I’m going to play with that. That’s actually happening.”
So, what if someone actually in favor of generative AI picks up Tremblay’s self-described “anti-AI screed?” He hopes that, at the very least, he’s made the ride enjoyable in a distinctly human way that might begin to reshape the conversation.
“I think that was another reason why I wanted to have the humor,” Tremblay said. “If people are reading this book who aren’t on the side of like, ‘Hey, LLMs taking authors’ books is bad,’ maybe if they read something that’s cut with some humor, that maybe they’ll be more easily swayed.”
Dead But Dreaming of Electric Sheep is now in bookstores everywhere.

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